Question about content producers.

[mynameisjim]

Alright, say I had an idea for a paysite, nothing really groundbreaking but sort of unique and different. Could I hire a content producer to shoot unique content that I specify or are they pretty much into shooting standard porn? Or possibly I was thinking they might not like being told what to shoot.

If they are comfortable shooting unique content, do they charge quite a bit more or is it all dependent on the cost of the talent?

Basically what I'm asking is how is it to work with content producers. Do you usually say "I need a boy/girl blowjob scene" or can you be quite specific.

I'm not on the verge of starting anything, just thinking out loud and trying to fill in a few gaps in my knowledge.

[sunfunbill]

Hey there mynameisjim. Since I took a look around because I am going to shoot some stuff of myself I know a LITTLE about it. You have to shop around and find the ones who shoot unique content. Most don't cause it's a pain, but there are some who do a lot of that.

As for price, it depends on just what it is, and how different it is. If you just want a 19 yr teen to shove a lollypop up her ass, that's a dime a dozen. If you want to have two shemales doing a straight guy, that's a whole other ball game. (just so you know, there are some who shoot that as exclusive.)

Price would be around $1,000 to $3,000 for, say, 500 pics and 2 hours of video, all of one shoot. Again, depends on just what you want. It would very quickly run into the 10s of thousands of dollars. I don't think it would be worth it unless you got money to burn.

As for myself, I will be doing sissy boy stuff, bondage, cd, femdom and a few more, all at no cost plus being able to jerk off in front of my two girlfriends, work work work!!!!!

If you need something I can supply send me a pm.

[sunfunbill]

Do you usually say "I need a boy/girl blowjob scene" or can you be quite specific.

Your paying to get exclusive stuff you want, you should and HAVE to tell them just what you want. In fact you should write a script, detailing just what you want. You don't tell a house builder to go ahead and make it the way he wants, you tell them just the way you want it. For a good price, of course!

[EDS]

hey Mynameisjim,

if ever you do need some content produced look me up. I can be as specific as you want down to every last detail. I've yet to produce content for anyone but myself and my partners but I'm willing to explore the options.

Sample of my work (my own site: everydayslaves.com)

[Cozy Monica]

Exclusive, and even semi-exclusive content is very expensive, in the sense that it costs thousands, just like Bill said.

I've heard anything from 300 up into the thousands just for one photo set.

This is the reason (well, one of the reasons) why setting up a paysite is so expensive. Getting enough content just to start is big money, and then being able to update often enough to keep your surfers happy is expensive too.

[porn punk]

Originally posted by mynameisjim
Alright, say I had an idea for a paysite, nothing really groundbreaking but sort of unique and different. Could I hire a content producer to shoot unique content that I specify or are they pretty much into shooting standard porn? Or possibly I was thinking they might not like being told what to shoot.

If they are comfortable shooting unique content, do they charge quite a bit more or is it all dependent on the cost of the talent?

Basically what I'm asking is how is it to work with content producers. Do you usually say "I need a boy/girl blowjob scene" or can you be quite specific.

I'm not on the verge of starting anything, just thinking out loud and trying to fill in a few gaps in my knowledge.

If you have enough cash you can get anything you want as specifically as you want. But now you're getting in "art so to speak". Though I've never dealt with porn director, I'm assuming they have the same hang ups as a main stream director.

It might not really cost you as much as it should if you can find some talented people trying to get themselves going which are swarming the los angeles area (and other places too). This part would be tricky because most people who think they are talented won't do porn at first.

This is where politics and cash meet and you have to balance the two out for what you really want deep down inside.

I like the idea from a creative standpoint at least, but that's what always makes me end up broke

[porn punk]

Plus what Monica said about the site perspective. I was busy whacking off over creative potential

This is fucking stupid, but did you ever think of just seeing what you could do yourself with a camera? Believable shit (amateur, reality) is huge so you could fine tune your skills as you go.

Of course I have no idea what you're skills are so if you were trying to do 9 and a half weeks (all that cosmetic commercial looking stuff) I'd be way off base.

But the WGA is on strike and amateur looking stuff might start taking over the air waves if they don't end the strike soon.

Just nonsense stuff to consider

[porn punk]

bad idea probably

[Paul Markham]

This is all speaking in general terms. And being a bit negative to show the down side.

For 90% of paysites you don't need exclusive content. The niches are so over supplied with sites it's IMPOSSIBLE for the guys who buy memberships to see 25% of what's out there. I'm sure 1% of surfers will know more then 26% of the content in a major niche but that's 1%.

TGP site owners don't want the same content being submitted every day from 5 different sponsors by 50 different webmasters, sponsors will buy the content though. So you need exclusive for affiliates, also the industry has convinced itself the members want it.

80% of the "exclusive content" is not exclusive. It's just a different girl doing the same thing being done on 100 other sites and 1,000 other scenes. Basically "another blonde on a sofa" content. To get a real twist into a scene to make it exclusive is very expensive and very few do it. Party Hardcore being one of the few.

Today can many people really afford to put up good 100% exclusive site and make a profit? A few can, the vast majority will struggle.

Solo girl site. 40 scenes at $400 a scene is $16,000 in content. Add to that the other set up costs. Assume content is 10% of your over all turn over budget. The site has to turn over $160,000 to break even. With an average stay of 6 weeks thats 3500 members.

Looked at a worse case scenario. But it illustrates why there is a severe shortage of good new site owners popping up. Even some of the big solo girl programs struggle to pay out $400 a scene and buy 40 scenes of a girl. The returns are not there.

Start aiming at boy-girl or lesbian and you can guess the hill you have to climb.

Shooting it yourself, like the 1,000 other sites doing POV? Did I say 1,000?

And that's just those who survived. Some have the talent to shoot amateur and some do not. The ones that do are on the way to building a site. But with models costing $300 to $1,000 a day and you need 10 days work to kick off it's ca be $5,000 in models fees alone and up. One good day with a threesome of good models can cost $5,000 in some places.

In short starting a decent size mainstream porn paysite with "exclusive" content is far too expensive these days for anyone but the big guys.

Going down the route of the minor niches is a route. What niches do you understand well enough? Met a major sponsor at the Prague show who spent a very big budget on a new big tit site. It's bombed and lost him money. He has money, equipment, network, affiliates and all the things needed. He bought exclusive content of big tit girls and the site failed. Why is simple, he got a guy to shoot big tits who does not have a clue how to shoot it. Affiliates and buyers just looked and moved on in big enough numbers to make it a failure.

So knowing what the buyer needs is essential in todays market.

It's 2007 and not 1997. Is the real answer to your question. LOL

[mynameisjim]

So wait, is everyone here saying starting a business actually costs money? I don't believe it!

Obviously I'm being sarcastic but I do understand where everyone is coming from regarding the price and difficulties so I appreciate your advice.

Really, I was more interested in how flexible content producers are when it comes to the look and feel of the work you request from them.

[Paul Markham]

Exceedingly flexible. In fact Monday I will write an email to all my content store clients stating.

WHAT DO YOU WANT US TO SHOOT?

The only problem is how much can you afford?

I will shoot you a unique hardcore scene, not exclusive, for $4,000 and up. There;s the problem more will buy a generic run of the mill scene for $2,000 and spend the rest on throwing traffic at it.

I'm not talkinfg some weird niche either. Main stream porn and unique. Well I've never seen it before.

[anotherF]

What can you take from that, you need alot of money and even more luck to win.

[Paul Markham]

Originally posted by anotherF
What can you take from that, you need alot of money and even more luck to win.

You don't need luck. Money, skills, experience and hard work are the ingredients.

When I quoted $4,000 it was for a unique and exclusive scene. Sorry when I read back my previous post it looked wrong.

[Lana]

Craigslist is full of guys that want to shoot porn. If you advertise asking for a quality camera (XL2 DVX etc.) They'll probably know how to use it.
My husband does hired gun gigs all the time.
$50.00 bucks an hour and he doesn't care what it is as long as he's not crossing his moral or legal boundaries. There's tons of guys out there with great gear and nothing to shoot.
You'll get it cheap if not free.

[Paul Markham]

Originally posted by Lana
Craigslist is full of guys that want to shoot porn. If you advertise asking for a quality camera (XL2 DVX etc.) They'll probably know how to use it.
My husband does hired gun gigs all the time.
$50.00 bucks an hour and he doesn't care what it is as long as he's not crossing his moral or legal boundaries. There's tons of guys out there with great gear and nothing to shoot.
You'll get it cheap if not free.

If pointing a camera is all it took to shoot porn I would be so very poor.

1,000's who want to be me, 1's who can be me. Thankfully.

[Lana]

I don't think anybody would dispute that there's only one Paul Markham.
If some kid shows up with a one chip camera and no audio or lights - kick 'em out. My point is, there's lots of (geeks) out there with the skill, all the equipment and know how with nothing to shoot. Offer him porn and he'll be drooling for free.
If he can white balance and hold a camera straight then throw in a decent editor, in my opinion you're golden.
Obviously the most heat is going to come from the model. That's the producers/directors job. Not the cameramans.

[Paul Markham]

Sorry Lana I just spilled my coffee. LOL Good joke.

So a producers/directors who knows what he's doing is going to employ a cameraman who does not because all the cameraman does is point, white balance and focus.

I'm not saying I'm special but I do have a clue.

Shooting good porn is more than point, white balance and focus. It's so much more that people should know if they are giving advice on it.

Last post on this subject, not getting into a flaming match.

[Lana]

Paul, darling, indeed no flaming match.
Your site makes a lot more money than mine so I'm not going to argue.
But I will.
You or your director tells the talent and the crew what to do.
Yes, your photographers/videographers have to put out a technically good product but the heat is in your hands. You have to make it happen. To get back to Jims question If you as the director hired us to film for you, we'll say yes sir no sir or whatever to make your film work. As a hired gun we're certianlly not going to try and force any kind of vision. And ... the technology is out there cheap. Broadcast quality equipment for under $3000 means there's a lot of qualified shooters out there willing to give you quality work dirt cheap,

[Paul Markham]

Lana, I said I would not argue, so not arguing.

So give me a pen am I able to write a book?
OK tell me what to write and am I able to write a book?

Yes to both, one is likely to do better than the other. Neither as good as the writer writing himself.

So give an untried, untested guy with a camera the chance to fuck up a $500 to $5,000 investment when I can pick the camera up myself? Not in my life time.

Shooting porn is so much more than telling a guy to put a camera on automatic and then telling him what to shoot.

It's about making models feel comfortable when they are trying to keep an erection or someone is sticking a dick in their ass, or just removing her t shirt with the impression she wants to fuck your brains out. It's about working as a team with the models, being part of the shoot and having the models trust, respect and faith.

Give some guy who posts on Craig's list the chance to fuck up a shoot?

Yes if he's paying for it and my time.

And please don't tell me about amateur, it's even harder to make a stranger act like a lover than people think.

[Lana]

It's about making models feel comfortable when they are trying to keep an erection or someone is sticking a dick in their ass, or just removing her t shirt with the impression she wants to fuck your brains out. It's about working as a team with the models, being part of the shoot and having the models trust, respect and faith.

My point exactly Paul. Who's creating that enviornment? Paul, the director? Or, a well white balanced cameraman waiting for his next instruction? All I'm saying is we or anybody else can come and shoot for you but it's your vision. Any guy with proffessional equipment can say "what look do you want" and do it but the vision is yours. There's lot's of guy's out there that are technlogically savvy or have a good eye but it's your or Jims gig. Of course anybody could put up big bucks and just pay a pro to create from start to finish.
Paul, I'm tired and starting to blather. We both need bed. But please post back because my husband and I look at you as someone who's a pro and that we can learn from. Thanks.